Okay, so I bought this car...

[jn1cz]

Good start huh? As a way of introduction my name is Mike. I'm in Houston. I've been driving z's for bout 10 years or so. Had 2 s130's, one T and one NA. Bought an '85 z31T in late 2000. Posted on other boards as zenarcher, mike85t, freewill. I had the linkmaker pages, the original vac lines page, and a couple other pages that were used a bit. So some of you know me to some degree or another. I sold the '85t a while back. Now I have an '88ss. I was just looking for an 88t but this deal was way too good to pass up. The price was so good I could put a new engine in and still have a good deal. I bought it with a blown HG. I'm getting the parts together for repairs and stuff. The engine is modded quite a bit. Has a tec3 w/ coil packs and MAP, cam, and crank position sensors, JUN pistons & rings, JWT S2 cams (dunno about the springs) Spearco ic, Aero FPR, and a few other small things that I can't recall right now. Oh and according to the PO it has 850cc injectors which seems like massive overkill to me. The turbo looks like a Nissan t3 but the PO says he had both sides machined and bigger wheels installed. I'm thinking better turbo after tax refund and profit sharing bonus.
The car itself is beautiful. Check it out here No body work and no rust except a little in the hatch area and under the battery tray all of which I've already taken care of.
Anyway, the engine ecu mods are way over my head so I have a lot of learning to do. And a few questions to begin with for the HG and t-belt replacement.
I can do the work w/o setting TDC but for reference sake I'd rather set it in case something gets screwed up. Is there a simple way to find TDC w/o having a distributor?
And if I can't set TDC am I right in thinking I should mark the external crank sensor parts and the "wheel with 2 teeth missing" that's mounted in front of the harmonic dampener?
And next I'd like to replace some of the crappy wiring. Some of the aftermarket wiring starts with one color/gauge and goes through one or two color/gauge changes before reaching it's destination. The injector clips are mostly trashed. Top feed injectors if that makes a difference. And the injector wiring is old and badly spliced. What's a good gauge wire for that?
In the meantime I'll be cleaning up the engine bay. No disrespect to the PO but it's not reassuring that someone could spend so much money on a car and not keep it clean. Looks like 18 years od hydrocarbon leftovers. I'm cleaning everyhting behind the bolts and brackets on the inner wells and the firewall and front braces. Next thing to go will be the breather cap on the drivers side valve cover. Maybe install a catch can?
If you read all this...thanks. If you read all this and didn't post about people getting in over their heads then double thanks

[MrwassmanNA2T]

All of the Timing gears have alignment dots. They kick ass for T-Belt replacement

[OR-Zman]

Good to see you here. I for one have a couple printed copies of your vac line diagrams around. Good stuff. Thanks.

TDC is really not relevant to the distributor but I'm not quite sure why you need do do this to begin with. :?:

Two teeth missing? Where?

Rewiring...why not.

Injector wiring and plugs- Wiring...I don't see any reason anything larger than stock size would be needed. I am guessing at 16awg. ??? Plugs- best bet get them from a parts car or there may be other sources I'm not sure.

If you need a backup on the injector plugs let me know via PM. I have an 84 parts car I can cut them off of if you want them. Pay shipping and they are yours.

[jn1cz]

Good to be here thanks. In the past I always lined up the marks on the cam gears and if the rotor was pointed at #1 I knew I was there for reference. Old habit I guess or maybe I'm just spooked about working on this car because of the tec3.
Anyway yeah if I just mark everything and if nothing moves I can count the t-belt teeth to get the new belt on. Maybe I better back up here because it gets complicated. I need to replace a head gasket and I want to change the t-belt while it's all apart, mainly because the PO left the belt cover off. I'm thinking he left it off because it wouldn't fit over the cam sensor bracket. The gears are pretty rusty and the whole engine bay is dusty and a little grimy from the breather filter on the valve cover so I think it's a good idea to change the t-belt while I have it apart for the HG. The gear with two teeth missing is part of the tec3 system. The gear is mounted to the crankshaft pulley and there's a sensor mounted beside it. I've got pics of the cam position sensor and I'll try to get some pics of the one on the cank pulley next week.
There was a lot of rewiring done for the tec3 sensors and for the injectors. It was all done kinda halfassed and sloppy which is why I want to clean it up.
Here's a pic where you can see the cam sensor and get some idea of the wiring:

[MrwassmanNA2T]

tellin you, the alignment dots help alot

[aceman]

hey zen/mike85, long time no see. I still dream of you silver 87? i beleive it was with they smoked tails. i think that was you 3-4 years ago.

put a fuse on that red wire next to the battery first

[Firehawk]

Sounds like a nice setup. If you get stuck, or just don't have time, you could bring it by my shop. I have fixed hack jobs before, on custom work.

[jn1cz]

Heya aceman. I had a red 85 turbo. Other than that you were right on the money If I remember right, you're in Texas too Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll see what happens when I get into the heads next week. In the meantime I'm cleaning up and repainting the engine bay. Gonna have to settle for plain white since I can't find any pearl white in a spray can. I may reposition the FPR and the coil packs too. I may redo the ic piping too. Most of the current setup is 2" with a little 2.25" and I have several 2.25" pieces left from a previous project. I found an inch of unwelded seam in one of the connections. Sloppy work. I need to find a way to modify an upper t-belt cover to fit over the cam gear sensor bracket. Anybody know where to get high heat paint somewhere close to the valve cover OEM shade?

[SATAN]

I run an electromotive TECII on my 85. If you want to find TDC line up the trailing edge of the 11th tooth on that 60-1 tooth trigger wheel. When the trailing edge it in the exact middle of the magnetic sensor that is TDC. To double check, you can line up the cam gears too. Put the dots on the cam gears as close to the dots on the rear covers as you can and see how close that 11th tooth is. You should also have 40 teeth on the T-belt between the dots on the cam gears for proper valve timing.
I have my 11th tooth marked with white paint. If you have any questions let me know.


WTF! I just noticed the pic of you mag sensor for the 60-2 tooth wheel. Is it mounted to the cam? Thought you said it was mounted to the balancer. Can you post a pic of the Mag sensor from a different angle. It should NOT be reading from the front like that! I dont know what is going on with that.

Just saw that you said it has cam AND crank mag sensor. BUT still it should be reading from the outer edge of the wheel. Where is the cam trigger wheel. It should be a 120 tooth wheel but I dont see that anywhere. Just a 1/2 inch mag sensor reading... I dont know what it is reading. The stock cam gear? which does no good. You have to have that 120 tooth wheel mounted to the cam gear. I dont get it. :shock:

[Z_Karma]

That was a cool name

Hey Zen. Welcome back!

Always thought you had the coolest board name...zenarcher.
sorry, you'll always be that in my mind.

Kinda like if AL87T came back as Z-nadian or something...
He'd still be AL87T to me.

[SATAN]

Its amazing to me that somone took the time and money to install a TEC3 but did such a crappy job installing it and everything else. WTF? Sorry I just cant get over that.

[jn1cz]

SATAN wrote: I run an electromotive TECII on my 85. If you want to find TDC line up the trailing edge of the 11th tooth on that 60-1 tooth trigger wheel. When the trailing edge it in the exact middle of the magnetic sensor that is TDC. To double check, you can line up the cam gears too. Put the dots on the cam gears as close to the dots on the rear covers as you can and see how close that 11th tooth is. You should also have 40 teeth on the T-belt between the dots on the cam gears for proper valve timing.
I have my 11th tooth marked with white paint. If you have any questions let me know.


WTF! I just noticed the pic of you mag sensor for the 60-2 tooth wheel. Is it mounted to the cam? Thought you said it was mounted to the balancer. Can you post a pic of the Mag sensor from a different angle. It should NOT be reading from the front like that! I dont know what is going on with that.

Just saw that you said it has cam AND crank mag sensor. BUT still it should be reading from the outer edge of the wheel. Where is the cam trigger wheel. It should be a 120 tooth wheel but I dont see that anywhere. Just a 1/2 inch mag sensor reading... I dont know what it is reading. The stock cam gear? which does no good. You have to have that 120 tooth wheel mounted to the cam gear. I dont get it. :shock:

I don't get it either but I'm pretty much clueless on this system. The PO said he had the tec3 installed by a shop. Like I said in the first post, it looks like a halfassed installation. There's no wheel mounted to the cam gear but there is a small disc mounted on the gear itself. The wheel you call 60-2 would be on the cam and the 60-1 would be on the crank? And when you say the 11th tooth, you're counting from where? Anyway yeah I'll have questions and thanks for the info.
And thanks for the welcome Z_Karma. You can call me zen or you can call me Mike. I wonder what Al and Adam and Danny are doing now. They'd be impressed with this board. I miss my best buddy Spot too. I'm going to have to see if I can find her.
This is the best closeup I have but I'll get more pics when the weather clears up here Saturday:

[SATAN]

[quote]jn1cz wrote:

I run an electromotive TECII on my 85. If you want to find TDC line up the trailing edge of the 11th tooth on that 60-1 tooth trigger wheel. When the trailing edge it in the exact middle of the magnetic sensor that is TDC. To double check, you can line up the cam gears too. Put the dots on the cam gears as close to the dots on the rear covers as you can and see how close that 11th tooth is. You should also have 40 teeth on the T-belt between the dots on the cam gears for proper valve timing.
I have my 11th tooth marked with white paint. If you have any questions let me know.


WTF! I just noticed the pic of you mag sensor for the 60-2 tooth wheel. Is it mounted to the cam? Thought you said it was mounted to the balancer. Can you post a pic of the Mag sensor from a different angle. It should NOT be reading from the front like that! I dont know what is going on with that.

Just saw that you said it has cam AND crank mag sensor. BUT still it should be reading from the outer edge of the wheel. Where is the cam trigger wheel. It should be a 120 tooth wheel but I dont see that anywhere. Just a 1/2 inch mag sensor reading... I dont know what it is reading. The stock cam gear? which does no good. You have to have that 120 tooth wheel mounted to the cam gear. I dont get it. :shock:
I don't get it either but I'm pretty much clueless on this system. The PO said he had the tec3 installed by a shop. Like I said in the first post, it looks like a halfassed installation. There's no wheel mounted to the cam gear but there is a small disc mounted on the gear itself. The wheel you call 60-2 would be on the cam and the 60-1 would be on the crank? And when you say the 11th tooth, you're counting from where? Anyway yeah I'll have questions and thanks for the info.
And thanks for the welcome Z_Karma. You can call me zen or you can call me Mike. I wonder what Al and Adam and Danny are doing now. They'd be impressed with this board. I miss my best buddy Spot too. I'm going to have to see if I can find her.
This is the best closeup I have but I'll get more pics when the weather clears up here Saturday:

No, the cam has to use a 120 tooth wheel due to the fact that it spins at half the crank speed. The 60-2 tooth is on the crank. There shouldnt be a 60-1 wheel, Ive never heard of that. When you count the 11th tooth you start at the missing teeth. Missing teeth =0 then start counting the teeth in the direction the engine rotates. The back edge of the 11th tooth lines up dead center on the mag sensor there needs to be about .040" between the sensor and the wheel. If there is too much space .060" or more the car will have very poor performance on the top end.

I still dont know what the hell is up with that cam shenanigans. I dont know why you would have two different sensors measuring the same thing. That and why is a sensor that measures timing is attatched to a flimsy ass rear timing cover like that! Thats a BAD idea.

Line up that 11th tooth and see how close the rest of the timing mark that are still there are. This will give you an idea of how close they got the trigger wheel to correct.

[jn1cz]

No, the cam has to use a 120 tooth wheel due to the fact that it spins at half the crank speed. The 60-2 tooth is on the crank. There shouldnt be a 60-1 wheel, Ive never heard of that. When you count the 11th tooth you start at the missing teeth. Missing teeth =0 then start counting the teeth in the direction the engine rotates. The back edge of the 11th tooth lines up dead center on the mag sensor there needs to be about .040" between the sensor and the wheel. If there is too much space .060" or more the car will have very poor performance on the top end.

I still dont know what the hell is up with that cam shenanigans. I dont know why you would have two different sensors measuring the same thing. That and why is a sensor that measures timing is attatched to a flimsy ass rear timing cover like that! Thats a BAD idea.

Line up that 11th tooth and see how close the rest of the timing mark that are still there are. This will give you an idea of how close they got the trigger wheel to correct.

Okay, I'll check that this weekend. BTW you're the one who mentioned a 60-2 wheel. The 60-2 tooth is on the crank. Must've been a typo.
I'll check the gaps on both sensors. I'll check to see if they're both connected to the computer. According to the PO the car had a tec2 previously and before that it had a JWT system. Another odd thing is that there is some type of nut on the butterfly valve of the TB. And the connector on the TPS isn't hooked up but the TPS connector for auto trannies does have a wire running off somewhere.
Thanks for the TDC info. I was pretty comfortable doing all the maintenence & repair on my 85t but this is a whole nother thing.

I just downloaded the tec3 manual but it's 175 pages long so checking for possible reasons to have two mag sensors could take awhile.

[SATAN]

The TEC needs the potentiometer style (auto style) TPS sensor. It only requires the connector that is coming off of the TPS with the wire. The other one does not have to be hooked up. I dont even know where one would hook it up to...

Yes, when I said 60-1 I screwed up. There is no 60-1.

Can you post a picture of what that sensor on the cam is reading? Like the actual wheel its reading from. I curious to see what the hell it looks like. From the pictures you posted it just looks like a stock cam gear and nothing else. Anyways, you should read that manual but i'm pretty damn sure that you done have to run a cam sensor AND a crank sensor. Its one or the other. If you find out that you dont have to run the cam sensor hang on to it because you may need it later to replace the one on the crank if it goes bad.